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One of them is a tool, another one is driven by a tool.
Erin O’Toole nods in agreement
The worst part with all these big trucks is the bed is significantly higher requiring much more effort to actually put anything in.
You’re not only looking like a dumbass you actually are one.
Honestly this. I had one of these that replaced my old Dodge van at work, and I hated it because all my equipment was much more of a pain in the ass to get in and out.
That’s something i often wonder–how do they manage to load stuff in/out? I’ll always remember a woodshop class i took and someone asked me to help lift a chicken coop they built into their truck. It was heavy af to begin with but the extra height to put it into his big/tall truck made it a much more difficult task. It’s just stupid, really–no benefit i can see and further drawbacks seem inevitable ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Forklift on one end, idiocy on another
Maybe they are more manly than you give them credit for?
If it’s hard for you to throw something in the bed of a truck you should hit the gym.
Really big and heavy item enters the chat
@SqueakyBeaver @ji17br Funny how such items enter chats a lot more frequently than they enter the bed of the typical suburban driver’s pickup truck.
The comparison is kinda unfair. The big truck has a wider bed, bigger tires and more power. It also seats more people. So it is able to get more load through more difficult terrain. However we can be quite sure it won’t be used in that way.
I’ve never seen one with wear and tear and/or dirt that would indicate difficult terrain. Those only leave the city in advertisements.
There’s a few in the country around here. The ones with dirt on them are almost exclusively the Toyota Hilux, though
up to but not including 7th gen hilux is more in line with what I would consider a reasonable truck design. I’d give them a pass before 2004 or so. The bulbous round ones, if people actually use them off the streets then it probably won’t offend me to see them on the road but personally I’d just have a small car for day to day and only use the truck for what I bought it for, storage insurance when I don’t need it. I’m still too scared of having my bike stolen to commit to no car it turns out. Some places are just too sketchy.
Are you around forestry, oil drilling, or similar sites? Obv most are fleet stock simple (with decent tires), but the 4 door, white truck with a V8 is ubiquitous when you need 4 grouchy dudes to effectively live out of it for a whole day, plus all their equipment and food. It’s hilarious how much shit these trucks hold and get anywhere with a 2 track
That truck isn’t this truck though. That truck is dirty, dinged and always in use. The part of this truck that gets used the most is the entertainment system.
Well of course not this one with all the candy. But same frame, same class of engine, same door configuration, etc.
The tonneau cover is usually there because A) they do mostly highway mikes and want the improved mileage resulting from reduced drag, and B) they rarely use the bed, as those covers are a PITA unless you only remove it once in a great while.
I live in Central America where its mostly little trucks owned by workers, and they often drive on mud roads and hard terrain. The only people with trucks like the black one in the picture are US expats with …particular political leanings.
Nearly every tonneau cover folds or rolls up. Outright removal is a pain, but using the bed isn’t.
The factory standard cover rolls up in about 30 seconds.
A lot of people wash them shortly after going off road to avoid rust and corrosion.
unless the owner does a full handwash, clay, compound, and wax every time, there is no way the trucks I’m seeing in my region are washed off road vehicles.
Lol that almost done like a chindogu ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chindōgu )
In a way I almost prefer that to the blatant posers I see driving around with huge lifts and offroad tires looking spotless in our muddy season out here. I was at the combo laundromat/carwash the other day watching one of them wash an already clean truck while I was thinking about the massive mud puddle I’d be driving through to get home.
My brother in law has a truck like the one on the right. That backseat area is huge. You could stop and have a picnic back there during a road trip.
I can’t imagine owing it. It looks dumb to me and it’s far too big for normal use. But he’s a cross country hauler, so it’s not a big truck to him.
And they have three kids, so I doubt he gives af about pp showmanship.
Yeah.
Sure, most people with a big truck don’t need one.
That said, the capabilities of the bigger truck far exceed that of the Suzuki.
I have yet to see a big truck carrying more than a ton of things, and I’m near home depot often. These trucks are capable of 800lb which should be fine for most people. I’d love a vehicle where if I found something I liked I could pick it up while still being a viable economical daily driver.
Do you live in an urban area?
I did say most people don’t need one.
How did society even function without these big ass trucks. They are so capable and essenti.
The pp size is inversely proportional to the truck size.
that’s why I ride a bike.
I could get away with a unicycle if it weren’t for my MASSIVE SCHLONG requiring support and it’s easier that way than getting two unis.
I suppose you are using a lady bike then so there’s more space for the schlong?
No I have a sheat for the schlong on the horizontal bar of the frame
This guy bikes.
Ironically with a woman’s bike IRL
What is lady bike?
Traditionally bikes for women had the horizontal stabilizing bar much lower probably to account for dresses and the like, but the differences has been slightly washed out over the years.
The top bike is referred to as the “lady bike”, as you’ve said, but for any external viewers, the top bike is probably a better choice for city bike in general. There’s the point about not having to swing your leg around when mounting and dismounting the bike, true, but the bike also promotes an upright seating position as opposed to a totally horizontal, leaned down, motorcycle like position, which will be more comfortable for long ride periods for most riders, at the cost of aerodynamics. The bottom bike is extreme overkill for most uses, but it’s also the bike you’re going to probably see most often in the US outside of mountain bikes, since nobody tends to commute on bike here.
I’m picturing the two unicycle method illustrated in the style of Dr Seuss
I prefer walking, and use a bicycle when it’s possible. So sadly doesn’t check out.
Bicycle size isn’t zero, you you pp size isn’t infinity. It does check out.
A tax on vehicle axle weight proportional to the damage done to roads (which goes up exponentially with weight).
Vehicle fee based on some combination of size, weight, and miles driven would be the fairest.
Miles driven is just taken care of in fuel taxes. Sales tax on size, yearly tax based on weightwould be perfect I think.
Yes, something that attempts to assess cost proportional to impact
EVs break this.
Happens many places in Europe already.
If you’re worried about making the cab bigger and comfier, you don’t need a truck.
There are no arguments to this and no one has a point against me here. If cab space is the concern, you need a minivan or SUV.
Blanket statement with impunity incoming. Combining these vehicles is a bad idea. For safety and efficiency. If you think this is a good idea in any possible way, you’re simply incorrect.
You’re just buying an SUV with a truck bed attached because your little balls say you want a “manly” vehicle.
You wouldn’t put a hitch on a moped. Don’t put a bed on a SUV.
Extending the length of a vehicle past the point where a hitch makes it longer than a parking space should be a “first offense your company is due down immediately” kind of offense first of all. The amount of these hitches blocking sidewalks and handicap accessibility spaces is absolutely bonkers.
Why don’t we have a president type of office that doesn’t mess with politics or international affairs, they just have nationwide power for common sense stuff like banning pickups simply being used as passenger vehicles, curbing attempts to overgrow parking spaces, and probably a bunch of other stuff too.
Also, I have a great idea for a whole new tax. :)
Let’s make an industry out of dining these people to the point where only businesses use trucks. Regular people can rent them easily enough to move between apartments or what have you, but these should never have been general use daily drivers.
Let’s just crush and compact the entire pickup truck industry to an incredibly tiny fraction of what it is now.
Stating in your argument “there are no arguments to this” highlights up front how close-minded you are to discussion on the subject. It’s perfectly acceptable to discuss things you strongly believe in while still allowing yourself to be open-minded about opposing views. In fact, I would say it is required for honest discourse to occur.
In my personal experience, I have one of these vehicles with a comfortable and spacious cab. It allows me to have one vehicle for all the tasks that come with a sheep and pig farm, and also allows us to transport our large family comfortably to and fro. I would like my family to be comfortable while riding in our vehicle, which is equally able to perform various work functions related to farming and transport a family. Why would we purchase and maintain two separate vehicles for these purposes when a single option exists?
Corn, wheat, and other farmers have separate vehicles to accomplish the tasks necessary for their farms, e.g. a combine harvester, seeder, iriggator, etc. I know they also have large spacious trucks as well, but my point is that it is feasible to expect an agricultural business owner, or any buisness owner, to have different commercial equipment for different tasks related to their industry. Besides, whereas all the people who need pickups for their business have them, not all pickup owners need their vehicles for business. I see many, many large pickups parked in residential areas of the city and around the suburbs. The closest most of those people get to agribusiness is going to the grocery store. That’s the second point, if you don’t absolutely need a large truck for business, you shouldn’t use one for your everyday driver. Imagine if big rigs were affordable for most everyone and people used them for daily driving.
While I agree that farmers can have specialized vehicles for different tasks, not all do. We farm sheep, pigs, chickens, and ducks and do not have specialized equipment. We don’t even have a tractor. I also don’t disagree that people who don’t have a use for trucks don’t need them, but I wouldn’t go to far as to say they shouldn’t have them. While objectively worse for the environment than a vehicle more suitable to their lifestyles, it’s a slippery slope (as we’ve seen) once we start legislating morality.
Bottom line: if we didn’t operate a farm business, we wouldn’t have a need for or the desire to have a large truck. More likely, any truck at all. We certainly wouldn’t have one to park in the driveway of the suburban house we would probably live in. It’s just impractical, but not everyone is gifted with innate pragmatism.
Laws are legislating morality. What else would they be?
commonly held misconception, laws in fact just spontaneously come into existence and we have no choice but to follow and enforce them (except for rich people, who are inherently better people and thus are able to disobey the law without consequence)
You wouldn’t put a hitch on a moped
My dude, I put a hitch on a scooter. My little trailer kicks ass. Well, it did before it was stolen, but that’s besides the point.
Sorry that your ass-kicking little trailer was stolen. 😟
It might still, just not for you
In addition, suvs are also unnecessary and unneeded.
You want a cross country vehicle? Get a jeep or a Suzuki samurai or a Unimog. You want to flaunt your wealth and show everyone how big you are on the road? Buy a tram company and lobby your city to install it. If you can’t do that, you’re not wealthy enough and have no right to flex.
I agree about SUVs actually, but that’s a different argument. That one is more opinionated, whereas I can’t even fathom this ones being arguable.
Good old jeeps. Same mileage as a pickup truck with no load capacity.
Trailers are great! You can tow with minivans, cars, suvs and trucks. Trailers typically are easier to load, have more capacity and can be a lot longer than a truck bed.
Contractors get most of their building supplies delivered by flat bed trucks anyways.
When I had to buy a truck I didn’t really care that the A/C and radio didn’t work. I didn’t care that the interior was stained and uncomfortable. I didn’t care that the ride was rough and noisy. I didn’t even care that much that it got bad gas mileage, as I wouldn’t be driving it much.
I needed a truck for truck stuff. I’m not gonna buy a truck with a leather interior when I’m normally covered in dirt when I’m using it. I don’t need it to look big and manly because I just need it to haul garbage and tow livestock trailers. And I definitely don’t want to pay $70,000 for something I’m going to use it offroad.
This is stupid. Why should a blue collar worker with a family have to buy and drive two different vehicles just because of your personal preferences. Building two vehicles is no doubt worse for the planet than making one slightly less efficient vehicle. This is especially true if we are talking about EVs which are the future of trucks this size.
TIL blue collar workers only exist in the US South.
I never said they did? I don’t live in the US
They are pointing out that you have alternatives, just like the rest of the worlds blue collar workers. Americans seem to weigh their personal comfort higher than nearly anything.
Are cars like this not sold in Europe? Their popularity in USA has much more to do with USA vehicle regulations than anything else.
The regulations are in place to maximize profit, so they make huge expensive luxury trucks.
In my experience, a large group of truck owners buy them purely for luxury. They are absurdly expensive vehicles, its impossible to justify buying them unless they fill all roles so they are now the family vehicle, grocery getter, daily driver, vacation vehicle, etc.
The two cars we own combined, brand new, totaled up to 40k, but we bought them used for a total of 20k. Thats easily 30k+ I could spend on a whole other vehicle, a trailer, modifications to my existing vehicles, or whatever else would make sense for a number of use cases.
Ego and status drive a lot of luxury truck sales, mainly because I dont know many blue collar workers that want to spend extra on an interior thats going to get destroyed from regular use anyhow. And the tiny beds dont help.
Surely you can buy these used?
While I absolutely despise the rise of dumbass suburban cowboys, making it to require a business to own one is kind of stupid. I mean growing up in farm land, you do often need a truck to do things like grab manure or lime, picking up feed, or the occasional carcass.
You could tax based on vehicle weight and vehicle type instead of a stupid, outdated gas tax and that could actually put a curb on this type of dumbass penis extender behavior. Maybe lesson it depending on where you’re registering it, farmland zoned and registered under gets less tax but I honestly think that unless you fix the stupid bro country, wanna be cowboy culture that leads to this suburban cowboy dumbfuckery, you’re honestly not going to make much of a dent even with taxes.
While I would be in favor of making vehicle sizes regulated we already have that but thanks to the requirement of dealerships and the lobbying from the big 3 tmcars here in America have minimum sizes rather than maximum sizes so if anything I believe it to be more ideal to break regulations so cheap affordable cars can finally be legal to build, sell and import
We had a quad cab Nissan Navarra (Frontier) working forestry. Four guys in the cab. Saws, petrol, oil, gear, tools, wire and fence posts in the bed. Fantastic vehicle, got everywhere. Could haul serious weight when needed. It was a tool that became a battered jalopy. We’d leave it in the yard every night. I’d take the train home, my mate cycled and the other two guys somehow squeezed into a Smart car as they shared a lift. We were all insured to drive it on public roads 24/7 but none of us saw the point. Great vehicle in its arena but a hindrance and inconvenience outside of it.
It’s a hatch back with a strapon.
For manly men.
You are definitely wrong, there is a market for it. It’s clearly not as big as it currently is, but there are absolutely people that families and work some sort of construction or farming job where a truck is necessary, and carrying more than 3 people comfortably is also necessary. And two vehicles is also not feasible.
That market is astronomically smaller than the amount of these large pickups with huge cabs being sold.
Yes, that’s what I said. Doesn’t change the fact that the market does in fact exist, unlike the comment I replied to was claiming.
What do you think construction workers in the rest of the world do?
Lorries with heavy capacity. Trucks of a different design but similar capacities.
That little truck in the picture is literally a construction work truck. They use those.
They have vehicles to carry more than 800 lbs.
I mean, fuck, I own a bar and need a pickup truck simply because how else am I gonna return 250 empty cases of beer to recycling? I ain’t putting that smell in an enclosed van and if I got an open trailer, I’d need a truck to tow it anyways. (I actually do have a van, I use it in winter and rainy days for picking up full beer cases, doesn’t have near the weight capacity of the truck although using the same motor and getting similar mileage)
I’d need a truck to tow it anyways.
Common misconception, but you do not, and a folding trailer hooked up to a car with a tow rating capable of pulling it takes up much less overall space when it’s folded up than the truck will most of the time. You’ll also probably get better gas mileage, which is a bonus, plus better pedestrian safety, less force going into a car crash which collectively makes everyone on the road safer, and makes it safer to crash into stationary objects, decreased roadwear, things of this nature. This sort of trailer setup is done all the time in europe, as another comment concurs.
I’m not putting 3000 lbs of beer bottles on a trailer behind a (modern) car. It’s borderline unsafe and over car capacity. You’re talking to a CDL holder, I do know s thing or two about pulling trailers. Cars domt have full frames anymore, that’s only one of the many reasons this bad idea
3000 lbs is well within the towing capacity of a VW Golf with a braked trailer. Not to mention a van.
LOL. I just looked up tongue weight max on a golf. 300 pounds. They’re literally useless and dangerous for towing anything over 1000lbs.
All those Europeans towing with their small cars must just be my imagination then.
Said three thousand pound load, that does not include the trailer. Gross weights gonna be 4500, 5000 ish. Vans are generally pickup truck drivelines this continent, so no real difference there for mileage.
No difference in mileage, maybe. Certainly a huge difference in danger to pedestrians and cyclists.
So without the pickup truck, you’d still be able to do it with an alternative.
No. Read it again.
Okay…so you need a truck to haul beer cans. What’s wrong with the simple low-profile one for that job?
The criticism is on freak hybrid SUV-trucks.
Do you know how much 250 empty cases of 24 bottles weighs? Its a lot more than the little one can hold. I had to construct 2x4 stake panels up to the height of the roof as it was with a full size long bed, in order to avoid making 3 trips (twenty miles to the depot), and it would take five with that little truck that can’t even hit highway speed. It also can’t tow my fifth wheel camper. (From 1983, before I get the rich person problems accusation. I ain’t rich, I’m rural and handy enough buy old shit cheap)
Nope sorry, you actually don’t exist. OP says it’s impossible for someone to need a truck.
That’s a real man’s truck. Air conditioned, soft suspension, big boi so scary big truck don’t scare, brightest lights because corners scary, 4 seats cos wife is scary, big tyres because tools are scary, big tank because human interaction is scary.
The thought of someone getting a 4 seater truck purely because they are so terrified of their own wife that he only feels safe when she is in the back seat of a car
That’s what it’s like to drive a Ford F150
NotJustBikes has a great spoof of this
One of them tows 12000 and can get on the highway and not die. The other has a payload capacity of 1500lbs.
What a dumb comparison. I own a Kei.
Except the people who own the monster trucks never carry more than 1500 lbs and rarely take it on the highway.
Except the people who own the monster trucks never carry more than 1500 lbs and rarely take it on the highway.
All of them? Like every single one?
Clearly there was some sort of global survey we aren’t privy to.
A little off the topic, but sometimes I wonder if driving a rally car with a cage, 5 point seatbelts and a helmet will be more safe on a highway. Like it seems to me that it is safer, but will it actually be?
It would be better able to handle a severe crash, but pretty inconvenient and pointless.
You can put a full and spec cage, bucket seats, and a 5 point harness in any car. You don’t need to go full racecar and take the interior out. You would need to wear a helmet, Hans device, and the full 5-point every time you drive the car because an otherwise survivable accident could kill you. You would also probably want a fire suppression system because a fire in a damaged car may not be escapable after you get hit without help.
You would be giving up airbags and visibility. Airbags can save you as much as a cage could. Visibility could prevent the accident in the first place. The cage and whatnot wouldn’t save you from a catastrophic wreck, but a serious accident would be more survivable.
You might as well just not drive on the highway or don’t get in a car at all if you are so concerned about your safety. Don’t want a baby, use protection. Terrified about having a baby and don’t think that protection is adequate, get sterilized or don’t fuck.
It’d be safer, but it wouldn’t be very comfortable. Rally cars have very barebones interiors to cut down on weight. You’d also need different tires and tuning.
You might be shocked to know that fitting a family of four plus vacation gear quickly approaches 1.5k.
Payload capacity includes how much people weigh. It’s not just how much you can throw in the bed.
That’s either a very heavy family or a lot of vacation gear! You would need all 4 people to be around 300lbs to start getting close.
It’s america, so it’s not impossible
A basic camping trip puts us right at the limit.
👌👍
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I drove pickup trucks for years. Most people probably don’t realize is how much higher the operating cost is compared to smaller vehicles, even if they know that it’s generally higher. The first hybrid I bought was a Prius about a decade ago and when I finally looked at the difference in the cost of fuel and maintenance, it was not insignificant.
There’s plenty of legit reasons to need a pickup but outside of that, you’re just throwing your money away. Nowadays our Sienna Hybrid minivan has a hitch receiver on it so I can hook the trailer up to it if I need to haul something big. I haven’t needed a truck in a long time.
I think you’re making up crap. Or at least you’re comparing an old vehicle to a new one.
My truck costs the exact same to maintain as all of the other vehicles I’ve owned. Gas usage is worse than a Prius, but pretty much inline with most SUV.
There’s really not anything that’s materially more expensive to maintain in a truck than any other car.
You can think whatevever you want. A conventional gas job requires 2 to 3 oil changes to every 1 on a hybrid, depending on if you’re changing it every 3k or 5k miles. Plugs and wires, brake pads, coolant, etc. also require more frequent replacement on conventional vehicles. I would know and I’ve got the financial records to back it up.
I would also know. I’m driving a hybrid truck right now.
I truly think you’re comparing an old car to a modern one. None of the stuff you listed needed changing with any regularity, one any modern car.
Could changed happen every 9k miles, brake pads are entirely usage based (going 80k+ miles on original), coolants might get changed once in the 200k lifetime of the truck, etc, etc, etc.
A lot of people who buy trucks these days just need something that can tow a travel trailer or a boat to their favorite camp site a few times a year. It’s not that they need a truck on a day to day basis, but they might need the towing capability on occasion. That’s why these trucks are a weird combination of luxury sedan (with their leather seats and high end interiors) and pickup truck. Most of the time they use it like a regular car, but sometimes they might need the towing capability.
If it’s a “few times a year” situation that really seems better suited to renting.
Rental companies, at least in America, have policies against using their vehicles to tow things.
In addition the truck in front has to be imported to the US and there’s weird regulations about purchasing them so you can only buy used. As far as I know you can’t import a new model. If a car is newer than 25 years old it can not be imported unless it meets the requirements of US Office of Vehicle Safety Compliance.
https://www.nhtsa.gov/importing-vehicle/importation-and-certification-faqs
These all sound like regulatory, issues. Nothing that can’t be fixed with a minimal amount of political goodwill.
I think it is regulatory. However getting US politicians to do what’s right is never trivial. It would take the legislative branch to change the regulations, while likely ignoring lobbyists within the automotive industry. It’s fixable but it won’t be fixed.
Michigan is an important swing state, and the UAW is a major political player nationally. Ironically, that doesn’t stop the US automakers from routinely screwing over auto workers and labor in general.
Part of the issue there is that for a large number of people the ‘few times a year’ are major holidays when everybody else wants to tow their house-sized RV and boat to the lake for a day or two. The rental fleet just isn’t big enough to service the surge demand.
Or maybe they’ve got the money
Pff my fckn subi can do that and fit in a standard car park
Your Subi wouldn’t be able to pull some of these American travel trailers. Many of them are absolutely massive, they’re like a luxury condo on wheels.
We have no sense of reasonable proportion here in the US. Everything must be unnecessarily large and unwieldy, gaudy and exorbitant. Bigger is always better here in the good 'ol US of A.
some of these American travel trailers
Can’t forget the boat! For reference, while this isn’t typical, it’s not uncommon. That’s a pretty small travel trailer and boat. I’ve seen this setup with much bigger trailers and boats several times.
Not uncommon at all. My cousin had a giant fifth wheel, and he would often pull his four wheelers behind it.
Excess pleases Slaanesh
Literally planning to buy a truck for when I need it and I’d still make it a daily driver if needed.
The bed on the left probably gets used more.
But the one on the left wouldn’t pass US fuel economy standards, which are based on vehicle footprint since 2012.
That’s the reason the Ranger etc were discontinued for a while, and when they returned were bigger than the old F-150s.
It’s so the reason the small cargo vans (Nissan NV200, Ford Transit Connect, and Ram Promaster City) were all discontinued in the last 2 years. CAFE standards increase over time, and it’s easier to just make bigger cars.
But you can still legally buy older Kei trucks in the U.S.
And they’re affordable.
https://boekiusa.com/inventory/new-jersey/paterson/all-vehicles/available
Not too many dealers specialize though.
But the one on the left wouldn’t pass US fuel economy standards, which are based on vehicle footprint since 2012.
Bigger cars consume more fuel.
Yes, but the regulation is a “amount of fuel per weight of vehicle”. In absolute terms it’s more.
It’s like when you’re buying produce. $10 for 10 strawberries ($1.00 per berry) and $15 for 20 strawberries ($0.75 per berry). The $15 option is “only” $0.75 per berry, but it’s also just more money in total.
It’s moronic to define fuel economy per pound of vehicle.
Agreed.
Unintended consequences, the plague on governments through history.
When a consequence is so blatantly predictable can it be unintended?
Functional design is the only proper design.
Kei trucks feel like they’d be a perfect alternative to a gator. They appear to be cheaper too even considering importation.
Gators are probably way better off-road, but otherwise you’re totally correct
I see your Gator and I raise you a Kei truck with tank tracks.
That is amazing and I need one. Unfortunately I don’t think threads are great for paved roads, so I doubt the government will let me drive one to the DIY store.
Unfortunately I don’t think threads are great for paved roads,
It depends on the type of tread, some are made to run on roads, some really aren’t, or just kind of tear up roads. It’s the same principle as running chains or studs on your tires when you’re not in the winter or not in the mud. If you have rubber pads for contact on your tread, it could probably be better considering the load is spread out much more compared to the relatively small contact patch of a tire. The problem is that you’re gonna outweigh that gain with the larger amount of emissions it’s gonna take you to go anywhere on account of your treads not being as efficient.
One is a work tool and for men, the other one a toy and for little boys.
The one on the right is an “Emotional support vehicle”.
The one of the left is awesome
That’s a great sentence… well done. It’s really tickled me.
