“I have severe untreated mental illness and no grip on reality”
(Emphasis mine)
That is a vast oversimplification of how people work. It is absolutely plausible to me that someone might believe obvious lies but is otherwise qualified to drive heavy machinery. Analyzing the society you live in is a totally different skill than driving.
For example, if I found out my bus driver literally believes that reptilians run the world, I would still trust them to drive my bus because driving a bus has nothing to do with lizard people. Conversely, I wouldn’t trust a bus driver who agrees with everything I believe in but is currently having a panic attack.
This is important to me because I am mentally ill (treated, but mentally ill nonetheless) and autistic (which is treated like a mental illness), and this is the kind of logic that tyrants use to manufacture popular consent to further marginalize mentally ill people.
Look, I understand the line you are trying to walk here, but encountering a vehicle like this and thinking “this guy just has different ideas than me, but is otherwise trustworthy” is not rational thinking.
There’s a difference between believing in conspiracy theories and covering your van with warnings about the nanochips on your body that give you computer generated diseases.
If I learned that someone suffering extreme paranoid delusions like this were in charge of operating a passenger vehicle, I would be extremely concerned with the safety of those passengers.
This isn’t some unreasonable thing. I have a lot of compassion for those who suffer from mental illness, but I also think that public safety should take precedent when it is clear that someone is mentally incapable of being trusted with things like heavy machinery.
It’s not the ideas expressed on this vehicle that concern me. It’s that every part of this indicates a serious and untreated mental health problem. The only way my opinion could be redeemed is if the owner of the van came forward and said it was a joke, or a prop for a movie or something, because nobody with a connection to reality is going to write those things all over a truck and parade around town trying to spread the word if they aren’t severely dissociated from reality.
And I cannot stress this enough, nothing about this story has anything to do with Autism. Paranoid delusions are not a typical issue for Autistic people.
And I cannot stress this enough, nothing about this story has anything to do with Autism. Paranoid delusions are not a typical issue for Autistic people.
Agreed, but I am autistic and I have had this language used against me to argue why I shouldn’t be allowed to make my own decisions. I.e., it is a popular misconception and form of rhetoric that autistic people have paranoid delusions because we perceive the world differently. I brought it up because I’m arguing from my lived experience as a mentally ill and autistic person, i.e. I’m not just being an internet contrarian.
I did not mean to imply that autistic people typically do suffer from paranoid delusions. However, (at least in my view) we do suffer from neurotypical people believing we suffer from paranoid delusions.
encountering a vehicle like this and thinking “this guy just has different ideas than me, but is otherwise trustworthy” is not rational thinking.
I don’t have to find someone completely trustworthy in order for them to be an acceptable driver. Actually, I typically don’t fully trust the people I get in cars with. I only need to trust them enough to know that they’re not going to veer into traffic, they’re going to drive reasonably, and that they will take me to the place we promised to go. I think that the kinds of decisions that go into driving are completely different from those that drive a person to mark up their car.
Look, I understand the line you are trying to walk here
Yeah, I am trying to “walk a line” here and I think I understand where you’re coming from, so I’m absolutely willing to agree to disagree.
“Where an objection to a belief is made, the assertion of the right to an opinion side-steps the usual steps of discourse of either asserting a justification of that belief, or an argument against the validity of the objection. Such an assertion, however, can also be an assertion of one’s own freedom from, or a refusal to participate in, the rules of argumentation and logic at hand.”
So, unlike you, I am not willing to “agree to disagree”, because this is an intellectually bankrupt position. You are overreacting to concerns regarding schizophrenic people and being irrational because of a personal concern about perceptions of Autistic people, despite nobody saying anything about Autism (but you).
I am also on the spectrum, and I wish you would think before you drag Autism into this conversation, because Autistic people like us don’t do crazy shit like this.
The guy driving this van is probably about as functional as someone in the middle of a panic attack. Very likely erratic and on meth I would not trust to drive.
The guy driving this van is probably about as functional as someone in the middle of a panic attack. Very likely erratic
I would have to talk to them first (or watch them drive if I’m in traffic) to see if that actually is the case, just like I would if the person’s car was clean.
There’s a big difference between a danger that is tangible and immediate, such as a collision with another vehicle, and something that cannot be seen or interacted with, like electricity or a virus.
There’s nothing about this that tells me this person can’t drive safely.
So where I live if you have a disease, physical or mental, you go to a doctor and they decide if you’re ok to drive or if you need to pass an extra test first where you are judged if you’re able to drive safely with whatever disabilities you have. This is besides the standard driving test and written test. Also everybody has to take lessons with a professional.
It’s however not perfect because the government doesn’t have access to your medical records (which is good). But that means you have to be honest on a form about your disabilities. Plus the doctor visit is not covered by insurance and costs around 200 euros.
Plus if you already have your licence there isn’t really a system in place to prevent you for driving if your health declines.
(Emphasis mine)
That is a vast oversimplification of how people work. It is absolutely plausible to me that someone might believe obvious lies but is otherwise qualified to drive heavy machinery. Analyzing the society you live in is a totally different skill than driving.
For example, if I found out my bus driver literally believes that reptilians run the world, I would still trust them to drive my bus because driving a bus has nothing to do with lizard people. Conversely, I wouldn’t trust a bus driver who agrees with everything I believe in but is currently having a panic attack.
This is important to me because I am mentally ill (treated, but mentally ill nonetheless) and autistic (which is treated like a mental illness), and this is the kind of logic that tyrants use to manufacture popular consent to further marginalize mentally ill people.
Look, I understand the line you are trying to walk here, but encountering a vehicle like this and thinking “this guy just has different ideas than me, but is otherwise trustworthy” is not rational thinking.
There’s a difference between believing in conspiracy theories and covering your van with warnings about the nanochips on your body that give you computer generated diseases.
If I learned that someone suffering extreme paranoid delusions like this were in charge of operating a passenger vehicle, I would be extremely concerned with the safety of those passengers.
This isn’t some unreasonable thing. I have a lot of compassion for those who suffer from mental illness, but I also think that public safety should take precedent when it is clear that someone is mentally incapable of being trusted with things like heavy machinery.
It’s not the ideas expressed on this vehicle that concern me. It’s that every part of this indicates a serious and untreated mental health problem. The only way my opinion could be redeemed is if the owner of the van came forward and said it was a joke, or a prop for a movie or something, because nobody with a connection to reality is going to write those things all over a truck and parade around town trying to spread the word if they aren’t severely dissociated from reality.
And I cannot stress this enough, nothing about this story has anything to do with Autism. Paranoid delusions are not a typical issue for Autistic people.
Agreed, but I am autistic and I have had this language used against me to argue why I shouldn’t be allowed to make my own decisions. I.e., it is a popular misconception and form of rhetoric that autistic people have paranoid delusions because we perceive the world differently. I brought it up because I’m arguing from my lived experience as a mentally ill and autistic person, i.e. I’m not just being an internet contrarian.
I did not mean to imply that autistic people typically do suffer from paranoid delusions. However, (at least in my view) we do suffer from neurotypical people believing we suffer from paranoid delusions.
I don’t have to find someone completely trustworthy in order for them to be an acceptable driver. Actually, I typically don’t fully trust the people I get in cars with. I only need to trust them enough to know that they’re not going to veer into traffic, they’re going to drive reasonably, and that they will take me to the place we promised to go. I think that the kinds of decisions that go into driving are completely different from those that drive a person to mark up their car.
Yeah, I am trying to “walk a line” here and I think I understand where you’re coming from, so I’m absolutely willing to agree to disagree.
This is called a “Thought-terminating cliche”, specifically this one: I’m entitled to my opinion
So, unlike you, I am not willing to “agree to disagree”, because this is an intellectually bankrupt position. You are overreacting to concerns regarding schizophrenic people and being irrational because of a personal concern about perceptions of Autistic people, despite nobody saying anything about Autism (but you).
I am also on the spectrum, and I wish you would think before you drag Autism into this conversation, because Autistic people like us don’t do crazy shit like this.
The guy driving this van is probably about as functional as someone in the middle of a panic attack. Very likely erratic and on meth I would not trust to drive.
I would have to talk to them first (or watch them drive if I’m in traffic) to see if that actually is the case, just like I would if the person’s car was clean.
I just blink my nictating membranes at them and carry on with my powerful government job.
There’s a big difference between a danger that is tangible and immediate, such as a collision with another vehicle, and something that cannot be seen or interacted with, like electricity or a virus.
There’s nothing about this that tells me this person can’t drive safely.
So where I live if you have a disease, physical or mental, you go to a doctor and they decide if you’re ok to drive or if you need to pass an extra test first where you are judged if you’re able to drive safely with whatever disabilities you have. This is besides the standard driving test and written test. Also everybody has to take lessons with a professional.
It’s however not perfect because the government doesn’t have access to your medical records (which is good). But that means you have to be honest on a form about your disabilities. Plus the doctor visit is not covered by insurance and costs around 200 euros.
Plus if you already have your licence there isn’t really a system in place to prevent you for driving if your health declines.