“Federal Election Commission records show Stein paid $100,000 in July to a consulting outfit that has worked with Republican campaigns, as well as Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s independent presidential bid. The firm, Accelevate, is operated by Trent Pool. The Intercept reported that he appeared to be part of the mob that breached the grounds of the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6., 2021. The Journal hasn’t independently verified the reporting.”
Wait so she is just using a consultancy firm that has previously worked with republicans? Is that the story here?
Yes as much as I don’t like Stein nor will I vote for her I feel the splurge of news on her is mediocre at best and very obviously being paid for.
She’s not done anything to warrant the scrutiny she literally hasn’t done ANYTHING at all. Why am I hearing about her so much?
Because the options to the Democrats was either do right by Muslim voters and take this genocide seriously, or attack anyone else they could vote for.
And not just republicans. You can find all stripes of accelerationist crazies doing that on this very website.
Including Russian trolls
We must bring about glorious revolution, even if our methods aren’t particularly effective and millions suffer.
No you see they have a plan.
- Convince people likely to vote for Harris to throw away their votes by voting 3rd party or staying home
- Suppress democratic turnout while leaving Republican turnout untouched.
- Spoil the election while haughtily going “oh not voting is a vote for trump somehow” and snorting to themselves. Completely blind to context.
- Have the things they claim to really super duper care about like genocide in Palestine continue under trump
- Also have vulnerable groups in America, like legal Haitian migrants, be the target of Republican vitriol.
- (step missing)
- Glorious proletariat revolution against the most powerful military and militarized police force to ever exist
Its brilliance is in its simplicity!
I’m much more interested in your plan than whatever strawman you can make up about the voters whom Democrats have left on the table for objecting to the genocide they want to fund.
Focus on getting progressives into local and state offices so they can build experience necessary to successfully run for federal office. Vote lesser evil for president in the meantime to buy time for progressive to get that experience. In 10-15 years of diligent efforts we can get progressives into probably about a 1/3 of our congressional seats. At that point, a progressive presidential candidate with congressional experience stands an actual chance of winning the presidency, and will have the legislative support to actually accomplish their policy goals when they get there.
How does this differ from the plan 10-15 years ago? Should we not be seeing returns if lesser evil voting did anything other than ratchet us over to the right? Should a politician have to do anything to earn the votes that put them into office?
How does this differ from the plan 10-15 years ago?
It doesn’t, we just haven’t been doing it. Progressives show up at mid terms in lower proportions than conservatives, we have to show up for every election, even the boring local ones. Governors and Senators become Presidents. If we want a progressive President, we need progressive Governors and Senators to nominate.
Should we not be seeing returns if lesser evil voting did anything other than ratchet us over to the right?
Perhaps I wasn’t clear: voting lesser evil is necessary for change but it is not sufficient. Again, the return on lesser evil voting is delaying the greater evil so that good can get into position. If we’re not using that delay to vote progressive into lower offices, then yes voting lesser evil accomplishes little else.
Should a politician have to do anything to earn the votes that put them into office?
This isn’t a productive perspective. Lots of things should happen. You shouldn’t have to look both ways before crossing at a crosswalk when you have the light; but if you follow “should”, you’ll have the satisfaction of being in the right when you get hit by a car.
The point of your vote isn’t to reward candidates for having the right policies, the point of your vote is to protect your interests. You vote lesser evil for the same reason you lock your doors, to mitigate a worse outcome.
That’s my point. I’m not convinced that my vote is protecting my interests at all, and what’s changed to make the story any different with the plan from 10-15 years ago?
The voting system works well for Republicans as it is currently. They have no reason to make the radical changes in the next four years that are being fearmongered right now. At least not any that the Democrats, with or without the president, would do anything to stop.
Every bogeyman propped up as reasons to vote against republicans has not slowed down under recent democratic administrations, who refuse to defend the rights and meet the demands of the people even in the face of clear power grabs by the other side. There is no firm policy being presented, only vague projections that it won’t be as bad as under republicans, who have shown us that don’t need the presidency. The tail is already wagging the dog in that respect and the side that claims to represent the left believe in decorum too much to say enough.
It is up to the democrats alone to convince anyone otherwise. We should not be scolding voters for being disillusioned by poor and ineffectual governance. If that’s where we’re at; blaming the voters for the failures of politicians that are first and foremost chosen by monied interests; then we’ve already lost democracy.
We can do this again in four years, just like we did it four years ago and four years before that, or we can get what we want right now by banding together and telling them that our votes are on the table only if they make a good faith attempt to meet our demands, and if we’re serious we will put our votes where our mouths are when the day comes. It’s not impossible to win that way, we just watched it happen when they switched out Biden for Kamala.
You’re going to have at least as much success doing that as you are scolding american voters every four years for voting their conscience just to then turn around and somehow convince them to be more politically active. Because that’s who you’re alienating, the handful of voters that actually care about the state of politics and may hold just enough power to swing a federal election. Certainly not the voters that are won just by having a larger campaign budget.
You can’t beat them, so join them. Do not let this political moment go to waste, do not let yourself be complicit in genocide. Put pressure on the democrats to acknowledge the genocide in gaza, to stop arming Israel. That will get everyone on the same side, along with being a show of good faith that voters wishes still matter to Democrats. At a minimum, open your mind to that possibility.
Do not let the establishment intimidate you into forgetting what power we hold as a collective, into actively working against collective’s own interests and shielding the establishment from the electoral consequences of their actions.
That’s not how evaluating a plan works.
Here, I’ve got a cure for cancer, shove pinecones up your ass.
You can determine that this plan is bad without having to have a cure for cancer.
Right, well you keep guaranteeing your vote for Democrats every year and attacking anyone that criticizes them for being ineffective and see how much that gets you, since their current platform and every election leading up to this one hasn’t been enough to prove that they don’t really care that much about defending progressive policy and will throw both it and their voters under the bus if they think it will help them tap into the republican base instead. Continue directing your ire at your fellow voters instead of using it to hold your elected representative’s feet to the fire. That definitely seems like a sound plan and totally isn’t more of what got us here in the first place 👍
It’s a nice straw man you’ve erected and if I did any of those things you might have some kind of point.
I didn’t attack anyone, I pointed out that this alternative plan is unlikely to bring about any substantive change either.
So you keep telling people to sit at home and I’ll wait for the glorious revolution, maybe if you shout down people and tell them to read more theory that’ll help. The American people are super into reading political theory.
Lmao I’ve never told anyone to read theory or to sit at home but go off I guess.
Haven’t we all known this about Shill Stein for a very long time, or are we supposed to pretend it’s a big shocking reveal so the leftists can feel better about being duped?
Are the democrat candidates not shills themselves?
That being said, fuck Jill Stein for squandering the Green Party. She needs to go awayWho are they shilling for? See, Comrade Stein is shilling for Russia. As we know- there is a connection. But who exactly would the democrats be accused of shilling for?
Lol what? Are you just totally ignorant to corporate involvement in politics? Do you know what a lobbyist is?
Comparing Russian influence on a compromised asset to lobbyists is a bit of a reach bud. But you do you!
Totally fine so long as it’s our rich people who control politicians, just so long as it’s not foreign rich people.
Nationalism is a hell of a drug.
But who exactly would the democrats be accused of shilling for?
Netanyahu. AIPAC bought two candidates right out in the open. The party welcomes foreign interference against progressives.
Israel paid directly for two candidates and committed FARA violations? That’s a big claim buddy. Got any… Evidence?
AIPAC paid to defeat Jamaal Bowman and Cori Bush. If you want to believe that AIPAC is actually independent of Israel, I can’t make you stop believing absurdities.
I know what AIPAC is. Your claim is that they have direct funding from the government of Israel. That’s illegal. You are allowed to set up a lobby group in the US that supports another country as long as the funds are obtained from within the US.
I know this might come as a shock to you, but there are many jews living in the US that happen to support Israel. You are welcome to set up any lobby group you want. Go ahead and set one up for Lebanon. But FARA is very clear about the source of the funds.
If youre not familiar with FARA take some time to acquaint your self? Or talk to a lawyer maybe? I don’t know.
Your argument in favor of foreign interests interfering in US elections is essentially “well, it’s perfectly legal, and if you don’t like it, help another foreign interest interfere in US elections.”
ROFL! Hilarious!
Yes, you find 14 pages of dead Palestinian infants to be the funniest shit ever. The perpetrator of the ongoing genocide in Gaza bought candidates for you.
No, I find your bullshit false accusations to be funny. Especially when it’s backed up by quite a lengthy mod log of removed misinformation and bullshit trolling attempts.
I have no sock puppet accounts. If I Had sockpuppets, my comments would have more upvotes and a lot more genocide supporters would have more downvotes. Only one comment I’ve ever made has been (unjustly in my opinion) removed as misinformation.
You’re just mad that I didn’t immediately shut up when you used “hilarious” as a rebuttal. Now you’re responding to my comments multiple times, spouting conspiracy nonsense, and going through my comment history to stalk me into other threads.
AIPAC
Hilarious.
I don’t think supporting genocide is.
The people duped by Stein are not the people who call themselves leftists.
On the contrary, many that call themselves leftists have been thoroughly duped. Or they’re all bad faith actors, but I try to never attribute to malice that which can be sufficiently explained by incompetence.
Duped, sure, but not by Stein.
I sort of was in 2016, I eventually voted for Hilary but considered Stein for a while after the DNC
No! Come on, everyone! Third party candidates are what’s best for the country. We aren’t doing this to dilute the vote, we just want to have our voices heard. Sure, everything we are saying is being said by the main two parties, but we also smoke a lot of weed. So, come on, guys, just vote for the Green Party.
Hear, hear!
She rejects the notion that her presence in the race could help Trump.
She can’t acknowledge that it’s possible this year? When it was known for a fact that it happened eight years ago?
I think everyone basically agrees - the key to getting those voices heard is to build the party from the bottom up, develop a grassroots and get folks elected at all levels of government who can help influence policy, starting local. Stein is the opposite of that.
Before Stein, the Green party had a marginal presence and was likely on the way out… I almost wonder, what if it actually did fall apart and die while Stein was in charge, but she kept the clothes?
Decades of shitty democrat policy with hollow platitudes and no action boosts Stein as the preferred candidate.
Fixed the title
I vote green in my own country, where it’s an actual organized party, and even I can see from here that Stein is a Republican plant at best.
Came on here to say this. Me too, practically.
No action?
On behalf of my gay daughter who will be able to marry who she wants to because of Democrats, I just want to say [REDACTED SO I WON’T GET BANNED]. And on behalf of my son, who is trans, [THESE WORDS WOULD ALSO GET ME BANNED].
Come to think of it, I have Democrats to thank for a return to sane pandemic policies, and Democrats to thank for the Inflation Reduction Act, the most impactful environmental legislation in thirty years. So you can take your “no action” and [NOPE, NOT GONNA SAY IT].
I’m under no illusion that Democrats are perfect, but they’ve been as effective as possible, given the situation with literal Russian assets on the other side of the aisle, trying as hard as possible to destroy America.
On behalf of my gay daughter who will be able to marry who she wants to because of Democrats
Democratic legislators won’t protect her marriage by codifying Obergefell, just like they refused to codify Roe when they had the chance. Democratic legislators spent decades on half-measures and it had to be decided by the Supreme Court instead. Now that sort of incrementalism is a dead end. SCOTUS works against the people.
What part of the last two decades had a filibuster-proof Democratic supermajority in the Senate? I’ll tell you: A two-week span under Obama, during which Ted Kennedy was busily dying in a hospital.
And what part of the last two decades had sufficient Democratic votes to eliminate or reform the filibuster? I’ll tell you that, too: None.
Perfect is the enemy of the good. Democrats have been good for my daughter. Republicans are guaranteed, 100%, to be much, much worse. Stop trying to sabotage her future.
Stop trying to sabotage her future.
When the Supreme Court overturns Obergefell, what’s Democrats’ plan to get her rights back? We gave them the necessary majorities to codify both Roe and Obergefell, and they did neither. And I’m not seeing any concrete plans to move the needle back on Roe. Do you suppose there are any for Obergefell?
When it happens, will you also make excuses for how the party squandered majorities that we gave them?
When? When exactly did we give them those “necessary majorities?” The last time Democrats held a 60-vote supermajority in the Senate was a two-week stretch during the Obama presidency, while Ted Kennedy was dying in a hospital bed.
And do you think denying Democrats Senate seats in the future will help my kids more somehow? Spell out how carrying water for Republicans is going to help them.
Any time in which Democrats had at least 50 was sufficient to kill the filibuster forever. We gave them necessary majorities and they squandered them.
And do you think denying Democrats Senate seats in the future will help my kids more somehow?
Did I say that? I can criticize Democrats when they’re useless (which is virtually always) without wanting fewer of them in the Senate.
My apologies. I’ve been getting inundated by people who purport to believe that dividing the left up is a winning strategy, and mistakenly clumped you in with them.
On behalf of your daughter who’s marriage may be under threat because of the Respect for Marriage act from Democrats she may be no better off then before 2012 depending where she lives. What protections have Dems provided for your son other than lip service in the face of republicans passing over 500 anti-trans bills the last several years? The DNC claims to have their backs while denying them affordable housing, livable wages, access to affordable health and mental care. Nothing but lip service from them.
The first 2 months of US bombs in Gaza had the same environmental impact as burning 150k tons of coal. That war has been going on for nearly 12 months. Out of one side of their mouth they talk about mitigating environmental damage. But their actions tell a different story.
On behalf of your daughter who’s marriage may be under threat because of the Respect for Marriage act
What the fuck are you even talking about?
If SCOTUS strikes down Obergefell or Loving it allows states to refuse licenses to same sex and/or interracial couples.
Ok? That’s on SCOTUS.
Then the entire argument has nothing to do with democrats and you “people” are giving Dems, who are mostly anti gay marriage, way, way too much credit.
Oh cute, a 1 day old account spouting nonsense.
