What is the purpose of Communism? Communism is not “enlightenment” it isn’t a religuous status, it’s a process. Working to put theory to practice, and correct as you go, is Communism.
The achievement of a “Stateless, Classless, Moneyless society,” ie Upper-Stage Communism, as Marx puts it, is a far-future society that has to be worked towards.
Because the people in power are not trying to make themselves obsolete and they all have some sort of class system that is actively maintained by the people in power
The government “collapsing itself” is not Marxist in any way, why would the government shrink itself? Additionally, what do you mean by “actively maintaining a class?” Have you read Marx? That might clear up some of your confusion.
Marx envisioned a historical process through which these conditions would be achieved:
1. Capitalism: Characterized by class struggle between the bourgeoisie and the proletariat.
2. Proletarian Revolution: The working class rises up to overthrow the capitalist system.
3. Socialism: A transitional stage where the proletariat controls the state and begins to dismantle the structures of capitalism. This involves reorganization of economic and social relations to eliminate class distinctions.
4. Communism: The final stage where the state has withered away, and society is fully classless and stateless.
The Government’s Role
The idea that a government could be “stateless in some sort” while not working towards making itself obsolete is contradictory in Marxist terms. For Marx:
• Any form of government or state that continues to exist as an authority structure inherently maintains some level of class distinction or power imbalance.
• A true movement towards communism would involve the state actively diminishing its role as class distinctions are resolved and social ownership is fully realized.
In summary, Marx’s definitions of statelessness and classlessness are intertwined with the dissolution of traditional state structures and the eradication of social classes, ultimately resulting in a society where cooperative, communal living replaces hierarchical and coercive systems of governance.
The bit on government. The State, for Marx, is the elements of Government that actively uphold Class Society, ie Private Property Rights. The role of government in AES countries should be to actively diminish class distinctions and remove the elements of the previous Class Society.
The government sort of becomes everything, ie the US post office is a government job. Trying to shrink government when the government is how everything gets made is silly.
Fair, no I see where we disconnected, what I wanted to say with no government is, I think, equivalent to what you refer as government becomes everything
To the classless part: are social credits really something that upholds class society? Is exploitation of minorities something that upholds class society?
And no, I have not read it yet, and I did not told you prior, since I feared you would stop talking normal knowing that
True attempt to achieve communism is not the same as achieving true communism, I’d say…
Why?
What is the purpose of Communism? Communism is not “enlightenment” it isn’t a religuous status, it’s a process. Working to put theory to practice, and correct as you go, is Communism.
The achievement of a “Stateless, Classless, Moneyless society,” ie Upper-Stage Communism, as Marx puts it, is a far-future society that has to be worked towards.
I don’t think current “AES” really work in the direction “stateless” nor "classless”. Maybe “moneyless” I could see that.
But I absolutely agree that the achievement of an upper-stage Communism would be fabulous
Why do you believe AES not to be working in the direction of achieving Communism?
Because the people in power are not trying to make themselves obsolete and they all have some sort of class system that is actively maintained by the people in power
Or in which “AES” is that not the case?
The government “collapsing itself” is not Marxist in any way, why would the government shrink itself? Additionally, what do you mean by “actively maintaining a class?” Have you read Marx? That might clear up some of your confusion.
Where do you disagree with that text?
The Path to Statelessness and Classlessness
Marx envisioned a historical process through which these conditions would be achieved:
The Government’s Role
The idea that a government could be “stateless in some sort” while not working towards making itself obsolete is contradictory in Marxist terms. For Marx:
In summary, Marx’s definitions of statelessness and classlessness are intertwined with the dissolution of traditional state structures and the eradication of social classes, ultimately resulting in a society where cooperative, communal living replaces hierarchical and coercive systems of governance.
The bit on government. The State, for Marx, is the elements of Government that actively uphold Class Society, ie Private Property Rights. The role of government in AES countries should be to actively diminish class distinctions and remove the elements of the previous Class Society.
The government sort of becomes everything, ie the US post office is a government job. Trying to shrink government when the government is how everything gets made is silly.
Have you read Marx?
Fair, no I see where we disconnected, what I wanted to say with no government is, I think, equivalent to what you refer as government becomes everything
To the classless part: are social credits really something that upholds class society? Is exploitation of minorities something that upholds class society?
And no, I have not read it yet, and I did not told you prior, since I feared you would stop talking normal knowing that