Hamas wants a permanent cease-fire. Israel wants a temporary truce.
I suppose having your victims very publically calling out for peace, and actively trying to push for negotiations alongside other countries would “confuse” the narrative that they’re supposed to be bloodthirsty animals.
I literally saw an article in the Israeli press talking about: Agreeing to a temporary truce would be a good idea because then we can use the pause to rearm, resupply, and rest, and then resume the killing having netted ourselves some goodwill on the world stage.
The reality is that both Hamas and Israel would do the same in a “permanent cease fire”. Hamas famously won’t sign a peace treaty with Israel - that’s how they became famous internationally in the 90s, by refusing the peace process. For the same reason Netanyahu - and most Israeli leaders - won’t sign a proper peace treaty with Hamas. Both want to eradicate the other.
Hamas has already stated they would agree to a permanent peace treaty if a Palestinian state is established.
Ergo only israel is currently in the way of a two state solution.
Where exactly has it decided that? And I dont mean in some Interview by one Hamas leader. This is a decision that the actual commanding structure of Hamas (most likely, both the Politburo and the military leadership) has to take.
Hamas again raises the possibility of a 2-state compromise. Israel and its allies aren’t convinced
In the latest iteration of its stance, senior Hamas official Khalil al-Hayya told The Associated Press in an interview on Wednesday the group would lay down its weapons and convert into a political party if an independent Palestinian state is established in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip along the pre-1967-borders.
Hamas has done these kind of statements for years, they explicitly never accept the Oslo Accords or a recognition of Israel. They dont offer peace, they offer truces. And again: that’s an interview with one single person within Hamas. I can guarantee you that there are multiple senior people within Hamas who will disagree with this proposal - because that always happens. Hamas doesnt work like a top-down organization where the lower personnel silently accepts what the leadership decides.
“No they said they want peace but they really don’t wanna! Also ignore israel refusing every peace deal and committing Genocide! And ignore when the Oslo Accords were about to be accepted and then an underling from Netanyahu assassinated the president of israel that was about to accept it! That was actuallly Hamas!”
Take a look over at the West Bank and it beecomes apparent without a single doubt which of the parties is the constant aggressor that refuses any peace.
It’s crazy how suddenly you guys see Hamas as the good guys all of a sudden. I can tell you about all their atrocities and rapes, but I’ll just get hit back with whataboutisms. Even if you point out that there are no good guys in charge in this conflict, people downvote cause they see Hamas as heroes, which is insane.
Can you seriously not understand that people have basic fucking empathy and don’t want children to starve? Families to be seperated by bombs?
Yeah, Hamas is awful. The Palestinian people would likely kill me for expressing my gender in a way that is barely safe in the US. I don’t fucking care, no culture deserves genocide. That should not be considered a controversial statement.
Hamas doesn’t give a single shit about starving children. Their leadership are old rich men living in comfort abroad.
Nobody is arguing against stopping this madness, but you’re white washing history by making Hamas out to be the victim here. Fuck Hamas, they don’t care about Palestinians. Neither do Arabs or Muslims. Nobody despises Palestinians more than other Arabs. You’re being used to Stoke outrage. You’re pushing their propaganda that Hamas was a peaceful organization just minding it’s business
Did I ever say that Hamas was good or ethical? Did I even say that I liked the Palestinian people? You are making the argument that an entire ethnic group should be murdered, abused, humiliated, and then dumped into mass graves because of the actions of a few assholes. That is what you are supporting. Look in the fucking mirror and realize that there is never, ever, under any circumstances, any excuse that you can use to justify what Israel is doing right now. The victims are the Palestinian people who are being fucking massacred.
Their leadership are old rich men living in comfort abroad.
Uh… No. Their leadership has two sides: Leaders in Gaza who actually manage the organization and command the fighting, and leaders abroad who get funding and negotiate with Israel and other countries. What do you expect? For their Gaza leadership to just ride an airplane from Gaza airport and attend diplomatic meetings? Because Israel blew that up 22 years ago. Point is: To function as a resistance organization Hamas needs some of its leadership to live abroad out of Israel’s reach.
Nobody despises Palestinians more than other Arabs.
I hear this a lot but nobody really justifies it. As an Egyptian at least according to my experiences it’s very incorrect.
Edit: Formatting.
Iran can’t beat us with bombs so they flipped the youth with very simple pr
I’ve been saying it for years. Zoomers are dumb. We have statistics to prove it. For years, people have been saying “oh gen z is so accepting, so progressive”. Yeah but that doesn’t matter because they’re stupid and stupid = easily manipulated.
Nah. No dumber than previous generations. Fuck, man, do you remember the internet in the 2000s and 2010s? Millennials and Gen X weren’t any brighter. And the Boomers had lead poisoning.
Probably smarter than Boomers, but definitely dumber than gen x and millenials
Idk. Boomers told millenials not to believe everything we see on TV.
Millenials were quick to get skeptical about everything and applied that logic to the internet as well.
However boomers appear to be believing everything they see on social media / news broadcasts.
And Gen Z appears to believe everything they see on TikTok.
That’s just tankies doing tankie things.
Every fault can be excused, as long as you’re an enemy of the US.
So I gotta ask, I been seeing people throw around the rapes again and it can’t possibly be the debunked nyt stuff right?
You realize this shit has been going on for like 7 decades right? Nyt debunked all of it? No they didn’t
Oh you’re talking about all Hamas’ atrocities and rapes over the last 70 years.
Hamas, the organization founded in ‘87.
The Muslim brotherhood suddenly changes its name in 87 and you all think it’s a whole new thing lol
The Muslim brotherhood exists presently. Right now.
So do Catholics, yet Protestants still exist!
The Protestant reformation famously was a bunch more than Martin Luther “changes [the churchs] name”.
That’s also a pretty bad comparison because both Catholics and Protestants treat each other as something different.
Even non-Christians see a significant difference.
What are you trying to say? Clearly metaphor and simile aren’t working right now…
When one side has committed such vast amounts of resources towards villainy, comparatively, it tends to make the other guys look better.
Have you even heard of Yasser Arafat or the history of the region? It’s like you kids just tuned in to the latest episode and made your decisions about who the bad and good are. All, EVERY SINGLE DOLLAR of Hamas resources go to rockets to shoot at schools and towards their own goals of ethnic cleansing. But you weren’t being told to be outraged for the last 6 decades, so you didn’t give a fuck till Instagram told you to.
Even if I say there are no good guys in charge in this conflict, I get dowvoted. Because you can’t accept that Hamas is bad, you just can’t.
I don’t use Instagram. I don’t use tiktok. Lemmy and mastodon are all I really use and I’m only on mastodon for the funny stuff. I know very little of the history of the area, and I’m not a history buff. Don’t care to learn. What I know is from the news (which can still impart biases of their own of course). Yes hamas is bad. The Israeli government is just as bad. They are using their military advantage to bomb families and starve children. They are committing genocide and we’re supposed to accept this because some of the people they kill are also bad? Fuck that. The atrocities committed by each side are on different scales. It doesn’t take much character to denounce genocide.
Have you even heard of Yasser Arafat or the history of the region?
We did, but let’s hear your explanation.
All, EVERY SINGLE DOLLAR of Hamas resources go to rockets to shoot at schools and towards their own goals of ethnic cleansing
Correction: Every single dollar of Hamas’s resources goes to rockets that force Israel to spend ridiculous amounts of money to stop them. They can also be used in saturation to deal more serious damage to Israel’s economy, as they are right now by forcing evacuations for some one hundred thousand people. Now it’s not pretty, but you won’t be taken seriously if you don’t acknowledge the reason they’re launching these rockets.
do you really think that Hamas would stop launching rockets if Israel stopped intercepting them?
I mean if they stopped intercepting them they’d have more direct military uses so no?
It’s easy to be the good guy when your opponent is genocide. I don’t think many people consider Hamas good people in a vacuum.
So you’re saying they’re good guys? Say it
I literally said otherwise. At this point you’re just looking for an argument or want to believe everyone who disagrees with you is a terrorist supporter.
I mean you’re upset about genocide but you never cared that Hamas wrote it into their Charter from the beginning that their goal was the genocide of the Jewish descendants and their extermination from the middle east.
So you only cared about genocide until recently.
The terms Hamas had agreed to were not immediately clear, but a senior Israeli official quickly said that the terms were not those that Israel had agreed to.
Looks like the headline matches reality.
You keep spewing totalitarian cacophony, you crazy diamond.
A ceasefire for you is when israel can keep committing Genocide and Hamas doesn’t fight back right?
A ceasefire is when both sides agree to cease firing. The article headline is quite clearly correct, but I know you aren’t interested in facts.
Conveniently ignore that Hamas accepted the ceasefire deal proposed by Egypt and Qatar, which means that both israel and Hamas very well know what is in the deal.
A cease fire is when both sides stop firing. Then you need the word deal to get there. Which Hamas has accepted and israel has not.
Conveniently ignore that Hamas accepted the ceasefire deal proposed by Egypt and Qatar, which means that both israel and Hamas very well know what is in the deal.
And Israel says the deal Hamas agreed to isn’t the deal they agreed to. Did you even read the article? Jesus Christ.
Four downvotes inside of a minute, lmao.
Dude has tons of sock puppet accounts. I got downvoted 18 times within minutes of responding to this guy before.
Good job you got there!
Hamas accepts the deal.
Israel rejects the deal.
See that’s what the article title should be. Not “complicates things”.
Hamas accepts the deal. Israel’s final response is uncertain - they commented that it was not the deal they agreed to, and it is not simply a matter of “Hamas has agreed, the ceasefire can go into effect”. But neither is it a rejection on the Israeli side. It ‘complicates things’.
Keep trying. You’ll show those big bad Lamestream Media types what for eventually, right?
I have accepted a deal Negotiated by Qatar where @PugJesus gives me all of his money indefinitely, this will go into effect immediately.
Is israel does not accept the ceasefire and invades Rafah after the proposal…
Then israel rejects the deal.
We’re not in a stalemate position. We’re talking about ignoring it and commencing a massively invasion to Genocide thousands of Palestinians
The mental Gymnastics you’re willing to do to defend israels Genocide is absolutely astounding.
The new deal accepted by Hamas was even brokered with massive American involvement:
The officials claimed CIA director Bill Burns and other Biden administration officials who are involved in the negotiations knew about the new proposal but didn’t tell Israel.
Between the lines: Two Israeli officials said Israel is deeply suspicious that the Biden administration gave guarantees to Hamas through the Egyptian and Qatari mediators about its key demand that a hostage deal will lead to the end of the war.
I accept the deal in which you hand deliver me all of your money.
When should I be expecting you?
(For the record, I’m 100% in favour of Israel immediately stopping all offensive action and immediately withdrawing from Gaza and being forced to immediately let aid in)
But this particular sticking point is kinda nonsense. If both parties aren’t involved in the development of the terms, then it’s just a political stunt to announce you’ve accepted them.
Israel could JUST as easily draft their own terms, and announce they’ve agreed to them.
Which funny enough they did iirc
Linkerbaan thinks October 7th was legitimate resistance and the most precise irregular operation in modern military history. I guess all those civilians were Secret Zionist Spies. You’re not going to get through to them.
Israel could JUST as easily draft their own terms, and announce they’ve agreed to them.
Linkerbaan vs PugJesus. Linkerbaan ratio is 5, PugJesus ratio is 2. Draw is 1. Results at 10pm.
On the serious note: An accessible link would be appreciated.
Wayback machine cuts off early, but this is what it gives:
The announcement by Hamas on Monday that it had accepted terms of a cease-fire added to the uncertainty that began over the weekend, when officials said that the armed group and Israel had reached an impasse after months of talks.
As if to underscore that the fighting would continue, Hamas militants on Sunday launched rockets from Rafah, their last stronghold in Gaza, killing four Israeli soldiers. The following morning, Israel announced a mass evacuation of areas in Rafah, escalating fears that the military would soon begin a long-anticipated invasion of the crowded city.
Hours later, Hamas suddenly announced that its leader, Ismail Haniyeh, had accepted a cease-fire proposal based on a plan proffered by Egypt and Qatar, which have been mediating the negotiations with Israel. The terms Hamas had agreed to were not immediately clear, but a senior Israeli official quickly said that the terms were not those that Israel had agreed to.
While Israel and its main ally, the United States, said they were reviewing the proposal Hamas had agreed to, the public statements by the two sides in the war suggest that they remain far apart on key issues needed to reach a truce. Here is a look at those differences.
Hamas wants a permanent cease-fire. Israel wants a temporary truce. The two sides are stuck on a fundamental question: will this cease-fire be a temporary pause to allow an exchange of hostages for prisoners or a long-term end to the fighting that would leave Hamas in power?
Israel insists on a temporary cease-fire, saying it will keep fighting afterward with the eventual aim of toppling Hamas’s rule in Gaza. Hamas demands a permanent cease-fire and vows to remain in power there.
AP is saying the same thing.
Thank you. It kinda sounds like there is a lack of information on what Hamas agreed to, for which I saw a post saying release of 33 hostages for 40 days of ceasefire. Can’t find it atm tho, the post may have vanished if it weren’t backed up with news.
When NYT can’t properly pluralize a word that already ends with “s” in a headline…
*Hamas’
While I want this to end as much as most people, a ceasefire is not the same as a peace agreement. North and South Korea have had a ceasefire since before I was born, but they constantly try to scare the world into thinking it could end at any moment, WW2 ended with a peace treaty, and the Nazi regime was officially removed from power as part of the treaty.
Of course it’s only a matter of time until israel starts violating the ceasefire as they always do.
But at least Netanyahu will go to jail first.
singling out Nettanyahu and saying that he will is not antisemitism.
Saying that all Israelis naturally will is however.
nobody thinks israel is going to break the ceasefire because they’re jewish. they think that because of israel’s well-documented history of repeatedly breaking ceasefires.
If you think that about the current government, yes.
But he explicitly said that Nettanyahu would be arrested. Which would mean a new government.
And if he says that any new israeli government would break it, it is.
I don’t even know how to respond to this, it’s that fucking ridiculous.
Soon simply criticizing a Jewish person will be anti-semitic to people like you.
That isn’t the case and you know it.
If I say “south Africa will always be a corrupt removed”, is that not racist?
Saying that they’re all the same in a negative way.
If South Africa has been a corrupt removed for 10 years, it doesn’t somehow magically become not-a-removed because the president changes.
The potential for it to become not-a-removed is there. It is not somehow magically fixed because one person is changed.
I can’t fucking believe I have to explain this shit, Jesus christ you people are the reason no one understands why Biden isn’t responsible for inflation.
Israel’s genocide of Palestinians did not start on Oct. 7th.
If you believe that Palestine is part of Israel, then how is it anti-semetic?
is that what i believe though?
or did you just make baseless assumptions?
