It’s late, but I wanted to come back to this momentarily. I think I was projecting too far, too fast. No revo is going to be perfect. We are perfectly imperfect beings, mistakes will be made, both revolutionary, and in any governmental and economical system that results thereater. My point is, in both, we can and should strive for as few as possible, because we want to establish that we are not exactly like what’s outgoing, or worse.

That may not happen immediately, but it can and should happen somewhat expeditiously.

ETA; as it stands, we may not be looking at revolution, but at filling a power vacuum, when the monied bail and leave the commoners without resources and unequipped to deal with massive, multiple crises, physically or psychologically. We’re going to need calm, steady presence.

I’ll sleep on it and reread it at some point in a few days. I’ll be pushed for time to clarify or reformulate a reply properly, until Monday or Tuesday.

I agree mistakes will be made and moralism can’t go on forever before intervention occurs.

I think power absolutely can and does corrupt, etc, especially if held too long by the same people. People in power positions should be rotated out to labor positions, and especially into the lowest paid physical positions, for a proscribed time. They can choose construction, beautification, service and hospitality with the same opportunities afforded to everyone else who do these jobs. And everyone who do these jobs should be afforded educational opportunities as available to any perceived elites, even if remedial education is necessary, prior.

Not saying indoctrination doesn’t exist but oftentimes it is used as an excuse when the observed behavior is actually simply a result of a person’s material interests.

It would seem to me a vicious cycle, and while cycles are certainly difficult and, the longer repeated, the more difficult they are to break; and with diligent, consistent effort, they most certainly can and are broken. Additionally, it fails where it’s always work and no play, because that is a huge cause of giving in to returning to a cycle, whether in conjunction with a government or societal institution which certainly has material interests in keeping the cycle repeating, even when it’s been somewhat destructive to the individual members of that culture or subculture, whether internally, externally or both. Then society complains about, and exacts some form of retribution for the natural consequences of that indoctrination. Psychological schisms lead to all sorts of material manifestations, none of them in the long term material interests of the culture, subculture, or individual. Immediate and intermediate gratification is extremely addictive to individual and institutions alike, and like most things that lean too far, for too long toward richness or leanness, undesirable manifestations begin to drip, then trickle, then flood individuals, institutions and whole cultures, in that order.

In such cases it is going to be very difficult to try and undo said indoctrination and possibly not worth the effort when you could be focusing instead on educating and organizing people whose material interest aligns with de-colonization.

I absolutely agree on the difficulty, and additionally, the investment of time, effort and money. Notwithstanding, to my admittedly limited understanding, Spectrum B disorders are just that, on a spectrum that shifts in either direction to varying degrees, depending on the diagnosis and the afflicted individual. Moreover, it seems that while some of the afflicted are born that way, others are merely born with the potential that gets triggered by adverse conditions, in youth or as an adult. CPTSD can continue into full blown BPD, NPD, and even ASPD, left unabated and/or exacerbated long enough. It seems to me, for example, that if murderers can successfully be rehabilitated and reintegrated into Scandinavian societies, then the failure of programs like Operation Paperclip wasn’t in concept, but by design. We thought good jobs and a good enough material life and standard places of worship would patch up the multigenerational trauma of the body and psyche of those chosen for integration into US society, simultaneously having failed to address the same conditions that led to the same atrocities in our own society! The caveat is, forcing therapy, especially by woefully underqualified (whether in natural talent, training, or the ability to translate theory to practice) has the tremendous and demonstrated potential to do more harm than good. I think we should try anyway and am unequivocally opposed to the death penalty, unless the offender requests it, and relentless monotonous hard labor, unless the offender requests it, only to return to too small cages, overcrowded and unhygienic. I do believe better programs can and should be developed, and continue to be improved upon, post haste.

That leaves us with an urgent need for immediate intervention, and I still think it is better to convene a group of individuals who are trained in the necessary fields (medical, psychological, correctional, educational) to develop an actionable plan, instituted by well-trained, closely monitored personnel, before any intervention is undertaken, lest the situation is made worse, or we perpetuate the same atrocities we denounce, and continue the cycle anew.

If rehabilitation and reintegration fails, we address it case-by-case. Prison guards and medical personnel absolutely should be rotated out after a short time, maybe two years for guards, 3-5 for medical, so they can deal with healthier society and avoid becoming unwell themselves. Maybe they’d be interested in public parks, or art, or something, and after a time away, inform improvement plans for rehabilitative institutions and perhaps eventually allowed to do another short term rotation in the rehabilitative facility.

It’s quite possible. I’ve said (and been heavily down voted elsewhere) before two things:

The real ritual abuse is offering up our children to self or others to be abused for financial eta; or other …constraints. This may be sexual, to make rent alone or keep Daddy happy so bills can be met, or being overworked and unable to direct anger at appropriate entities, bearing in mind that abuse can be financial (no money for sports or scouts), physical (not having patience, time or skills to properly address conflict/upset betweens and you parent or child so even non-brutal spanking for frustration or expedience to brutal punishment/compliance, also not allowing idle hands to prevent mischief), sexual (whether complicity, simply not seeing signs, leaving a child with daycare that exploits or refusing to acknowledge exploitation by other children or asking why children are overly brutish or sexualized) and

Unless we make contact with our own psychological demons, understand them, love them, they control us. Once we do that, they become our holy guardian angels, in that base instincts/survival techniques that once served a purpose in certain aspects can be acknowledged, worked with, what is useful kept, what isn’t “bound” “sacrificed/to” etc to be “put into our service.” For example, drinking to excess regularly, sacrificed either permanently or until moderation is achievable, depending on individual temperament and self-regulatory ability, which is theoretically, expandable/contractable. There are other esoteric (not to be confused with exoteric) terms available. Exoteric is noticing patterns around us, but that is only part of the whole. After which we turn our eyes inward to see corresponding patterns and how they can be manipulated or tempered.

Eta; this abuse can also be toward our own and others’ inner children, vulnerable, wounded both, eg 'triggering the lib/right/left". Triggers are only good if they prompt self reflection and offer a way to heal, eg the difference between lancing a boil or merely poking it for immediate, malicious gratification. And we kid ourselves about it.

Yes! And no! Think Augeries of Innocence or Vitruvian Man, or "Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven, and even The Magic Flute Which brings us back the way of the oroboros to the blursed Tree! Or “all paths lead home.” Eta: That said, Yeats was entirely opposed to Crowley’s admission to the Golden Dawn and there was a bit of a feud between them, which is at once amusIng and not. Yeats had valid points.

There are probably people who literally blood sacrifice to honor or obtain things from Satan. They are probably a bit delulu. Or outright frauds like that satanic panic author from the 80s, The Satan Seller. Animal sacrifice in magic is sacrificing the worst beast qualities to rid us of sin, nasty qualities, but then you’re headed into astrological territory.

If you really want to dig in, YT channels are plentiful.

Eta: I probably could have just referenced superposition and entanglement.

Crowley is deep AF but requires not dismissing nor even thinking he was a Satanist. And you have to hunt, if you’re interested. Duquette is a help.

I’m really appreciating librewolf, right now.

I understand your frustration and am often in that, with you. Maybe I’m naïve, but I’m currently hopeful it’s worth a try.

If they aren’t exposed to the truth in these places, they will likely never encounter any truth at all, except the grains of truth sprinkled into liberal lies as hooks.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HBwGbPfJty4&pp=ygU_SmVmZnJleSBzYWNocyB0aGUgaGlkZGVuIHBvd2VyIGJlaGluZCBldmVyeSBwcmVzaWRlbnQgbW8gZ2F3ZGF0

I’ve been getting into hermetic kabbalah, Lon* Duquette and Manly P. Hall lately.

Pay taxes, feed, clothe, heal people, look after prisoners, be nice to people, otherwise myob. I see it.

He and Roger Waters hit the ball out of the park, imo.

And space lasers and weather.

Did you watch the same Sach speech I did?

Catholics d6ear communism?

I would love to visit China, Vietnam.

Agree

Where I live, you can see s mansion next to a barely standing hovel. It’s wild.