Hey all,
I’m currently developing a Marxist-Leninist analysis of settler colonialism, especially in light of the situation in Palestine, and am going to read Settlers: The Mythology of the White Proletariat by J. Sakai for the first time. Before I do I was just curious what other comrades think of the book and its analysis? It seems a pretty controversial text among many online Marxist groups, to whatever extent that matters, but as an Indigenous communist I feel having a clear and principled stance on the settler question is important for all serious communists. I’m not sure if I’ll agree with Sakai specifically, but since I generally agree with the opinions of y’all, I was curious as to your thoughts on the book.
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Bad analysis of Settler colonialism. Not marxist. It’s maoist/anarchist fedcore writing. Like other vaguely leftist or post-marxist books like Bullshit Jobs it gets latched onto by people who don’t read.
I will admit the white surprise line is funny.
Anyways, archive deleted the other two but there was a good series of blog posts about how Sakai doesn’t exist and is possibly just fed agitprop. https://web.archive.org/web/20220504082412/https://skeptomai.substack.com/p/j-sakai-mim-and-anarchism
I’ll wait for the Samir Amin thread!
Great book. I disagree with his conclusions (my take is there is a white working class especially with neoliberal proletarianization, but it’s extremely important to consider them as part of an oppressor nation) and it’s not dialectical, but it’s definitely worth reading. I wish someone re-did it today (for more recent data and Marxist analysis. I’m impressed by the scope of the book and I learned a lot from it. You should probably read more better done and specified books along with it though, like ‘the red deal,’ ‘fresh banana leaves,’ etc.
I’d consider any of Zak Cope’s work, especially divided world, divided class, as some of the best modern works addressing labor aristocracy / socialized bribery theory and neocolonialism in the modern era.
Roxanne Dunbar-Ortiz also has great stuff, an indigenous peoples history, and loaded are excellent expose’s of the US settler garrison.
Totally, also Gerald Horne’s great work among others.
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The pessimism makes more sense given the context of the time it was written in. I’ve heard Gerald Horne’s Counterrevolution series described by some as a more contemporary analysis that succeeds Settlers.
I think the controversial rap the book gets is due more to its more dogmatic followers. Like a lot of maoists/third worldists, they have accurate observations but draw questionable conclusions from them.
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According to you, maybe. From where I sit, the decade’s watchphrase has been “second, third, fourth, and fifth-through-tenth verses, same as the first”; where the first verse was the failure of Reconstruction. For 100+ years, settlers have done us the dirtiest(right behind to the damn-near-totally-extincted tribes of the Indigenous if I’m honest), and it doesn’t appear to be changing its intensity, just its manifestations. So… Why isn’t that pessimism applicable?
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Sakai’s is wrong, I don’t even think you all agree with what he’s saying.
I think you like FUKNSLAMMER posts as much as I do.
But do you really think there is no revolutionary potential to the white working class? Maybe this makes sense to people who pigeon hole themselves into media criticism and engagement with malevolvent right wingers.
But the majority of the white working class are not part of the labor aristocracy that is into MAGA shit. I don’t think you would agree with the statement that the white working class has no revolutionary potential.
Take a look at where all the JROTC kids come from
*Sakai’s conclusion is wrong
Saying something’s a decent book doesn’t mean one agrees with everything. Most of the people in here include caveats in their support for the book. In my opinion it’s mostly factually and emotionally accurate for the time. But things have changed since then, neoliberalism is proletarianizing white people to a large extent. The text is also sadly lacking dialectics. We do not have no hope in the white working class. We know there is some hope that they will fight for the right side in wars of national liberation. However, settlers must know the revolution is not theirs. We will no doubt benefit (surviving climate change, transitioning to a healthier sustainable lifestyle, avoiding pollution, less queerphobia, workers democracy, and so on), the only caveat being it’s not their nation and they don’t have the possibility to own land (not that most of us have any land anyway). We will fight for it alongside the oppressed nations, and others who were previously neutral will join.
In my opinion it’s mostly factually and emotionally accurate for the time
With all due respect this means absolutely nothing and this is not the foundation for a serious conversation.
You should probably look at what the book has wrought before you start talking about how great its vibes are. You familiar with a Mister Gazi Kodo?
All I’m saying is it has some decent history and it’s pessimism made sense for the time. Writing a book and getting some dogmatic and uncritical followers is different from starting a cult. That’s like blaming mao’s writing for polpot and Gonzalo.
You would really enjoy Samir Amin’s perspective on Maoism vs Sovietism I think
If I have any weird middle of the night rancor in my posts (it never feels like it at the time) just know I’m tired of hearing the same pseudoleftists like Sakai and Zizek get play over dependency theorists and other interesting shit like that
It’s a good book that’s worth reading, even though I disagree with some of Sakai’s conclusions, and I think he was unfair to certain multi-racial leftist groups like the IWW.
I’d also recommend An Indigenous Peoples’ History of the United States.
The funny thing is that Sakai is actually very positive towards the IWW, they come off as one of the best white organisations in US history. I’ll admit, though, that he does critique them in regards to their syndicalism.
Maybe I’m thinking of a different org, it’s been awhile since I read it
Nah, he did critique them on their lack of analysis on imperialism and the state. Generally, Sakai was pretty rough on everyone in the US. He did say a lot of positive things about the IWW, though, which is very unlike every single white organisation (liberal or radical).
He absolutely tore other unions to shreds, though.
